B58TU HPFP failing on BM3 Stage 2+ OTS with E85?

n55david · 08-31-2023, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrxToBeamerGuy

It has to be based on how much boost you're running. More air means more fuel and E85 isn't as energy dense as gasoline so not only does more air mean more fuel but more E85 also means more fuel is required. You could run full E85 with the boost reduced.

I'm aware.. just saying on the stage 2+ multimap the car had issues at about e70. I don't care about running low boost to be able to run e85, it's a waste of my time etc

Cytoplasm0671 · 08-31-2023, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrxToBeamerGuy

Run the stage 2+ E30 map and mix in E40 - E45 and you'll have clean logs and way more power than what you're doing now. Like I said previously if you want to run full E85 you'll need a custom tune that basically neuters your car because the hpfp and lpfp wont flow enough to run E85 AND higher boost.

I have a Flexfuel sensor, and I love it since it's easy to calculate the right ethanol percentage. Is there a way to do this E30/E40 thing you're talking about with the Bootmod3 OTS Flexfuel map or should I I run the E30 map without multimap?

Here are my BM3 stage 2+ Flexfuel logs for E40, and one of them still shows a knock:
1. https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64c928b7d10b430fde83d589
2. https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64c927dfd10b430fde83d556

WrxToBeamerGuy · 08-31-2023, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by n55david

I'm aware.. just saying on the stage 2+ multimap the car had issues at about e70. I don't care about running low boost to be able to run e85, it's a waste of my time etc

I guess I just also want to point out that getting lean codes doesn't have to do with the LPFP not flowing enough. The DME will lower load target if there is any fueling limitation. Like on Cytoplasm0671 log's it's only targeting 160 load instead of 215 once he raises his ethanol that high. He will eventually get lean codes too. Look at his LTFT its sitting at 1.14 which is too high. This can be fixed by increasing the fuel scalar table to lower the LTFT and he wouldnt get a lean code.

n55david · 08-31-2023, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrxToBeamerGuy

I guess I just also want to point out that getting lean codes doesn't have to do with the LPFP not flowing enough. The DME will lower load target if there is any fueling limitation. Like on Cytoplasm0671 log's it's only targeting 160 load instead of 215 once he raises his ethanol that high. He will eventually get lean codes too. Look at his LTFT its sitting at 1.14 which is too high. This can be fixed by increasing the fuel scalar table to lower the LTFT and he wouldnt get a lean code.

Actually yeah, good point!

WrxToBeamerGuy · 08-31-2023, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cytoplasm0671

I have a Flexfuel sensor, and I love it since it's easy to calculate the right ethanol percentage. Is there a way to do this E30/E40 thing you're talking about with the Bootmod3 OTS Flexfuel map or should I I run the E30 map without multimap?

Here are my BM3 stage 2+ Flexfuel logs for E40, and one of them still shows a knock:
1. https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64c928b7d10b430fde83d589
2. https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64c927dfd10b430fde83d556

Yes you're right, it doesn't look great. Try the E30 map. Because you're running the multimap on E41 it is using timing values interpolated between the E30 map and the E50 map.

If you just run the E30 map with E41 you'll get cleaner logs than if you run the multimap with E41.

Its the middle of summer and your IATs are at 115F that isn't helping either.

Cytoplasm0671 · 08-31-2023, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrxToBeamerGuy

Yes you're right, it doesn't look great. Try the E30 map. Because you're running the multimap on E41 it is using timing values interpolated between the E30 map and the E50 map.

If you just run the E30 map with E41 you'll get cleaner logs than if you run the multimap with E41.

Its the middle of summer and your IATs are at 115F that isn't helping either.

I really appreciate this post

johnung · 08-31-2023, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by n55david

B58..
I actually started getting a lean code for e70.. no fuel cut though. Maybe I'm an outlier though and have a weaker lpfp? Idk

No that’s good information. I suspected something like that. So often it’s just some assumption or hearsay being repeated.

It’s interesting that the Precision Raceworks B58 LPFP upgrade actually keeps the stock LPFP as the primary and adds a Walbro 450 as the secondary. They claim up to 850hp capacity on a B58.

The Walbro 450 when used on the N55 actually replaces the stock N55 LPFP and becomes the primary LPFP that is on all of the time. The Walbro 450 can actually run full E85 on the N55, but it’s pretty much at capacity. So I always recommend the next size up, the PR Stage2.5v2. It uses the larger Walbro 535, also as the primary LPFP, but it can run full E85 on an N55 plus has extra capacity to also run an upgraded turbo. (Probably not a monster upgraded turbo which would need a dual LPFP setup, but it would run a Pure500 on E85 easily.)

johnung · 08-31-2023, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WrxToBeamerGuy

Sorry you went through that and selfishly I'm grateful you did because now I know about it. Glad it's all working out!

Hey, that’s how it works. We all learn from each others misfortunes. Haha!

I posted much of what I learned about the EKP over multiple posts, but I could probably do a cleaner single post.

I have not really posted everything that I’ve learned about the LPFP yet. I’ve discovered a method to completely eliminate any danger of overheated connectors, melted wires or melted holes in LPFP top hats. I’m going to test it first before talking about it much. I have to pull out my PR LPFP and photograph & document every step carefully.

Cytoplasm0671 · 08-31-2023, 06:48 PM

Any danger of igniting fuel in the tank if the LPFP is too taxed?

-Eidos · 08-31-2023, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cytoplasm0671

Any danger of igniting fuel in the tank if the LPFP is too taxed?

Nope

5w20 · 09-02-2023, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by n55david

B58..
I actually started getting a lean code for e70.. no fuel cut though. Maybe I'm an outlier though and have a weaker lpfp? Idk

Does your fuel pressure drop? Lean code could have nothing to do with the ethanol content.

I have no problem with E75-E80 in the tank with LT4 style HPFP and stock LPFP on BM3's stage 2+ MM w/FF sensor.

A90TJ · 09-03-2023, 02:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cytoplasm0671

I have a Flexfuel sensor, and I love it since it's easy to calculate the right ethanol percentage. Is there a way to do this E30/E40 thing you're talking about with the Bootmod3 OTS Flexfuel map or should I I run the E30 map without multimap?

Here are my BM3 stage 2+ Flexfuel logs for E40, and one of them still shows a knock:
1. https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64c928b7d10b430fde83d589
2. https://bootmod3.net/log?id=64c927dfd10b430fde83d556

Does your ethanol sensor have a controller that is CAN bus compatible?

If it has CAN capability you just need to run the 2 wires into the can bus and use the BM3 multimap, it will automatically scale to your e content.

Here is my log on e52 bm3 multimap, in the logged channels you can see e content and blend factor according to the content %. Only got timing corrections (under 3deg) in 5th after IAT’s hit 130.

https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=64c9...729b9cf06b0af4

n55david · 09-03-2023, 06:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5w20

Does your fuel pressure drop? Lean code could have nothing to do with the ethanol content.

I have no problem with E75-E80 in the tank with LT4 style HPFP and stock LPFP on BM3's stage 2+ MM w/FF sensor.

No pressure drop..
I reflashed the multimap and have a new p2 sensor to swap in.

08-31-2023, 06:48 PM	#31
Cytoplasm0671 Armchair Aristocrat 331 Rep 444 Posts Drives: 340i 6MT Join Date: Sep 2022 Location: West Michigan iTrader: (0)	Any danger of igniting fuel in the tank if the LPFP is too taxed?
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