F30POST
F30POST
2012-2015 BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > BIMMERPOST Universal Forums > General BMW News and Cars Discussion > BMW U.S. Reports November 2014 Sales
proTUNING Freaks
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      12-02-2014, 06:13 PM   #23
G07xG80
Captain
G07xG80's Avatar
337
Rep
710
Posts

Drives: 2023 X7 - 2024 M3 Comp
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: CT

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey335is
Cornfusing?? It's my opinion.. Don't take it too heart.. Stop acting like you own BMW.. When you probably only sell them

Yes. It's your opinion. So far it's not shared by at least 347,709 people this year... Plus me ! :-)
Again... enjoy your 335is... and look up the term Luddite...
Enjoy your 1... That's why people are choosing Audi and Mercedes over them.. Hmm
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 05:59 AM   #24
bavarian19
General
bavarian19's Avatar
United_States
516
Rep
18,858
Posts

Drives: Car
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: VA

iTrader: (23)

As an owner of 3 previous BMW's, I cannot fathom buying another one until BMW does some soul searching. Sure, BMW's were always slightly more expensive than competitive luxury cars, but the price point on new cars are just out of this world.

BMW has concerned itself too much with creating redundant variables of the same car, and not making the products better. I see far less f30 335's around than E90's. Why? Some people have voted with their wallets. Who is paying 60k+ for a 335? Not that many. More people badge whoring and buying 320s and 328s (which there is nothing wrong with, but sets a tone for the brand).

How has moving the Z4 upmarket worked for BMW?

BMW used to say that they wanted their buyers to grow with their cars. Start with a 3 series, and as life progresses, move into a 5 series, and keep moving up. I just don't see that anymore.

I only see one potential BMW in my future, and BMW refuses to make it. Give me an m135 rwd sedan with respectable luxury options for 45k.
Appreciate 1
      12-03-2014, 06:53 AM   #25
Matski
Captain
Matski's Avatar
England
151
Rep
842
Posts

Drives: A slow BMW
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: England

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey335is View Post
Enjoy your 1... That's why people are choosing Audi and Mercedes over them.. Hmm
What? That makes no sense?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bavarian19 View Post
Who is paying 60k+ for a 335? Not that many. More people badge whoring and buying 320s and 328s (which there is nothing wrong with, but sets a tone for the brand)

....

I only see one potential BMW in my future, and BMW refuses to make it. Give me an m135 rwd sedan with respectable luxury options for 45k.
Let me get this straight.. you're complaining that when people option up a car by $16,000 it makes the car too expensive... and that people who decide to buy a cheaper version are badge-whoring (which sets a tone for the brand (?)), and yet you are the one complaining about the price, and you would like them cheaper... yeah that makes sense.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 07:31 AM   #26
Hagasan41
First Lieutenant
Hagasan41's Avatar
United_States
262
Rep
344
Posts

Drives: 2013 E92 ///M3, 1999 E36 ///M3
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Florida

iTrader: (1)

It certainly be argued that BMW has lost a bit of it's luster in the last couple of years. The company has been a bit diluted in an effort to streamline the production process and increase profitability.

The marketing for the brand is a little flat compared to Audi and Mercedes and the M division has been a bit boring. I'm sure with some clever advertising and tweaking of the current cash cow models, they'll bounce back.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 08:50 AM   #27
fecurtis
Banned
United_States
3260
Rep
6,299
Posts

Drives: 2014 BMW 335i M-Sport
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Arlington, VA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwalls90 View Post
There isn't a value proposition with BMW's anymore compared to other luxury brands, and enthusiasts are jumping ship. They don't have enough standard equipment, and the prices keep increasing. Only people they're aiming to appeal to as of late are badge whores, and I guess even they have a tipping point.
lol these are luxury cars, there was never a "value" proposition.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 08:53 AM   #28
fecurtis
Banned
United_States
3260
Rep
6,299
Posts

Drives: 2014 BMW 335i M-Sport
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Arlington, VA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey335is View Post
My opinion is BMW should just kept what it was.. A 3 a 5 and a 6..
It's only 9:52 AM EST but this will probably be the dumbest thing I'll read all day.

Let's hope you are not and never will be in charge of any strategic business decisions...ever.

This thread is basically full of people BMW does not (and shouldn't) care to cater to. For the cars you people want so badly, go drive a Mustang or something. BMW shouldn't cater to that demographic.

Not sure why people want BMW to build cheap cars, as if they used to at any point in their history. Go buy a Challenger or Camaro and call it a day.

The lack of standard equipment excuse makes no sense to me either. German automakers have ALWAYS been known to lack in standard equipment. Want more standard equipment? Buy a Lexus or Infiniti.

Lol it's funny, this is one of the few car forums I've ever been on where everyone seems to hate their car. Just sell it and get something else and complain about how awful BMW's are on a Chevrolet forum or something.

Last edited by fecurtis; 12-03-2014 at 09:26 AM..
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 09:22 AM   #29
CJPatel
First Lieutenant
37
Rep
381
Posts

Drives: SF90, Urus, V12Vantage, M8, M3
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: NYC

iTrader: (4)

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwalls90 View Post
Much like the 3 series dropping off of C&D's top 10 list, I'm not upset that their sales didn't match up to last November's. Some sales damage to them might slap them in the face and serve as a wake up call.

Regarding 5 series, I think it's fair to say that the chassis is reaching end of life and buyers are waiting for the next model.

Regarding the X3, it's just too expensive.

There isn't a value proposition with BMW's anymore compared to other luxury brands, and enthusiasts are jumping ship. They don't have enough standard equipment, and the prices keep increasing. Only people they're aiming to appeal to as of late are badge whores, and I guess even they have a tipping point.
Excellent point, BMW really lacks with standard equipment and even option equipment. I had to jump to a 550i to get everything I wanted in my car.
__________________
SF90, Urus, V12 Vantage, E46 M3. DD: M8

Gone: AventadorS, 13' Ferrari 458, AM V12 Vantage 6spd, F82 M4, 2013 LP550-2, F430 Spider, AM V8 Vantage 6psd, E92 335i 6spd, 2003.5 E46 M3 6spd, Audi A7, 2011 BMW 550i.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 09:36 AM   #30
Imola.ZHP
Colonel
Imola.ZHP's Avatar
United_States
129
Rep
2,218
Posts

Drives: 2014 BMW i3 BEV EE
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Mud Island, TN

iTrader: (0)

BMW attempted to address the A3/CLA by offering the 320i in the US.

It failed.

Make us a proper 2er GC already, please. But don't mess it up like the 4er Gran-HATCH, make it a true sedan like the 6er Gran Coupe. Thanks!
__________________

- 2014 CPO i01 BEV Electronaut Edition Capparis White Tera World, '17-
- 2015 CPO i01 BEV Laurel Grey Tera World, '17-
- 2015 i01 REx Laurel Grey Tera World, '15-'17
- 2003 CPO 330i ZHP Imola Red Build 03/03/03, '06-'15
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 09:52 AM   #31
Fugly M3
Major General
Fugly M3's Avatar
4904
Rep
5,051
Posts

Drives: 2023 M3CX
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (5)

Wow...the 3 and the X3 are literally propping up the brand. I think the undertone here is that BMWs have gotten too expensive. Not enough cars in that $400 per month range for the target uppity consumer.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 10:39 AM   #32
fecurtis
Banned
United_States
3260
Rep
6,299
Posts

Drives: 2014 BMW 335i M-Sport
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Arlington, VA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by E46M54325Ci View Post
Wow...the 3 and the X3 are literally propping up the brand. I think the undertone here is that BMWs have gotten too expensive. Not enough cars in that $400 per month range for the target uppity consumer.
Your undertone would be misguided. Cars like the A4 and C-Class and their entry level crossovers prop up the brand and actually bring in the cash and sales numbers. The other cars sell in much smaller numbers and build brand prestige.

Just last month BMW posted it's largest sales month ever beating out Audi and Mercedes, maintaining the sales lead in the US.

Reading this thread, you'd swear BMW just filed for bankruptcy protection. Armchair analysts here are always amusing.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 10:56 AM   #33
Matski
Captain
Matski's Avatar
England
151
Rep
842
Posts

Drives: A slow BMW
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: England

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by fecurtis View Post
Reading this thread, you'd swear BMW just filed for bankruptcy protection. Armchair analysts here are always amusing.


Fact is that people will use any negative percentage (in an otherwise record year) to somehow try and validate every little moan they want to have about the brand.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 11:23 AM   #34
vladberca
Major General
vladberca's Avatar
Romania
763
Rep
5,560
Posts

Drives: '18 octavia 2.0 tdi dsg
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Craiova

iTrader: (0)

I think that Macan affected the sales of X3. I don't understand the sales of the 5er. They should add a 220i to the lineup. In Europe is available an 114i model!
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 12:54 PM   #35
cc3
Major
621
Rep
1,333
Posts

Drives: 1M, GT4, M2 M140i G40
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: .UK

iTrader: (0)

When my X5 comes up for change I will probably go to Porsche. After 30 years of buying BMW their products no long excite me. Exterior design has just become boring and predictable. They seem to want to be the new Ford or General Motors. In the UK a Ford Mondeo now has a better resale value than a 3 series. BMW has geared manufacturing capacity so much that the only way they can sustain the volume necessary to keep the factories busy is to offer big discounts. Might seem good for the buyer in the short term but it's a road to ruin for the manufacturer.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 01:12 PM   #36
chumley
Captain
chumley's Avatar
50
Rep
776
Posts

Drives: 2009 335
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Naples, FL

iTrader: (1)

BMW has basically become a leasing company that happens to sell cars. I'm guessing the bean counters have concluded (and from a financial standpoint - correctly) that it's all about pumping the sales numbers. The numbers show that despite the proliferation of models, only a couple carry the sales for the whole company. In other words, $3XX/month leases their entry level cars.

Most buyers in this category are not enthusiasts, they're looking for a car that reflects the perception of success. Having driven most of the lineup over the past year not one of the standard issue models stands out as anything to covet - especially if you have owned them in the past. The last 528 loner my wife just had was perfectly fine but completely forgettable. They've figured out that once you get a customer in a lease you can generally provide enough incentives to retain them, the CPO and sell the car a second time when they turn it back in. I'm sure that makes good business sense.

If there's any observation I'd be concerned with recent BMWs is that they have become very "parts-bin" oriented IMO. I don't care what anyone says, there is not that much difference in the fit, finish or details in any of the cars from the 1/2 on up through the 5's. Sticking a thin piece of metal at the bottom of an overly lacquered piece of wood trim doesn't make a car upscale any more than sticking pretty much the same headlight, turn signal and window switches in every car. If they lose the cache and interest rates make these "cheap" leases a thing of the past they will have a real problem.
__________________


MHD flash, DCI, BMW PE, ETS FMIC, Powerflex, SWS8xi's, VMR 803's in Solar Rain, LUX V4
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 01:17 PM   #37
ATSR
Captain
United_States
43
Rep
852
Posts

Drives: 1977 Honda Civic
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wellington, FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmk227 View Post
I like how the spin mini brand up 9.5%. The YTD trend of -17.4% is not a good sign for the mini brand
Noticed the same thing. Regardless what they say about some cars being delayed at customs (or something like that) the fact is that BMW has wrecked the MINI brand. Every single model they offer is hideous, massive and the latest one is the most hideous and offensive yet.
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 02:33 PM   #38
Matski
Captain
Matski's Avatar
England
151
Rep
842
Posts

Drives: A slow BMW
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: England

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cc3 View Post
When my X5 comes up for change I will probably go to Porsche. After 30 years of buying BMW their products no long excite me. Exterior design has just become boring and predictable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cc3 View Post
I will probably go to Porsche. After 30 years of buying BMW their products no long excite me. Exterior design has just become boring and predictable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cc3 View Post
go to Porsche. Exterior design has just become boring and predictable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cc3 View Post
Porsche. boring and predictable.


Seriously though. Yeah. Porsche are definitely leaders in revolutionary design.


Also...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chumley
The numbers show that despite the proliferation of models, only a couple carry the sales for the whole company.
You do understand that niche models (I assume it's the even X's and the GT's you're referring to with your proliferation comment), are by definition NOT supposed to be one of the supporting pillars for the whole company?
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 02:56 PM   #39
eldo33
First Lieutenant
eldo33's Avatar
26
Rep
355
Posts

Drives: 325i B. Red/Terra
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: sacramento

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2006 325i  [8.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joey335is View Post
My opinion is BMW should just kept what it was.. A 3 a 5 and a 6.. The 1s are so ugly and the 2s are ugly as well.. All these different models is just confusing.. Keep it simple BMW.. With reasonable pricing.. I would never buy a brand new BMW.. I could afford it and I would never..60k?!? When you can wait a year or 2 and pay 35.. The whole 1 lineup sucks.. Btw I love my 335is!!
yup...i'm with you on this too. $50k+ is pass the point. 2-3 years for $35k is best pricing.
__________________

2013 E350 - Wife
2013 GLK 4Matic - The Family
2006 BMW E90 325i - Self
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 03:00 PM   #40
eldo33
First Lieutenant
eldo33's Avatar
26
Rep
355
Posts

Drives: 325i B. Red/Terra
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: sacramento

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2006 325i  [8.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by fecurtis View Post
It's only 9:52 AM EST but this will probably be the dumbest thing I'll read all day.

Let's hope you are not and never will be in charge of any strategic business decisions...ever.

This thread is basically full of people BMW does not (and shouldn't) care to cater to. For the cars you people want so badly, go drive a Mustang or something. BMW shouldn't cater to that demographic.

Not sure why people want BMW to build cheap cars, as if they used to at any point in their history. Go buy a Challenger or Camaro and call it a day.

The lack of standard equipment excuse makes no sense to me either. German automakers have ALWAYS been known to lack in standard equipment. Want more standard equipment? Buy a Lexus or Infiniti.

Lol it's funny, this is one of the few car forums I've ever been on where everyone seems to hate their car. Just sell it and get something else and complain about how awful BMW's are on a Chevrolet forum or something.

CORRECTION -- we don't hate our cars. We hate where BMW is heading with the pricing.

apparently you have $$ to waste which is good for you and the dealer that you're leasing from.
__________________

2013 E350 - Wife
2013 GLK 4Matic - The Family
2006 BMW E90 325i - Self
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 07:46 PM   #41
E90M3JETS
Banned
65
Rep
207
Posts

Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Chicagoland

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imola.ZHP
BMW attempted to address the A3/CLA by offering the 320i in the US.

It failed.

Make us a proper 2er GC already, please. But don't mess it up like the 4er Gran-HATCH, make it a true sedan like the 6er Gran Coupe. Thanks!
Amen
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 10:01 PM   #42
justinnum1
Major General
651
Rep
5,803
Posts

Drives: 2018 330i Msport 6mt
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: South Florida

iTrader: (0)

competition catching up, BMW not what it used to be. no surprise here. I use to be BMW buyer not even think of another brand, now it's a toss up.
__________________
F30 330i Alpine white/Coral red Msport 6MT
Appreciate 0
      12-03-2014, 10:33 PM   #43
Fugly M3
Major General
Fugly M3's Avatar
4904
Rep
5,051
Posts

Drives: 2023 M3CX
Join Date: May 2006
Location: SoCal

iTrader: (5)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imola.ZHP View Post
BMW attempted to address the A3/CLA by offering the 320i in the US.

It failed.

Make us a proper 2er GC already, please. But don't mess it up like the 4er Gran-HATCH, make it a true sedan like the 6er Gran Coupe. Thanks!
Sad part is, if you just want a driver's car with minimal frills, the 320i is actually a great car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
competition catching up, BMW not what it used to be. no surprise here. I use to be BMW buyer not even think of another brand, now it's a toss up.
I'm right there with you.
Appreciate 0
      12-04-2014, 06:13 AM   #44
valeram
Major
37
Rep
1,413
Posts

Drives: 992 TTS, 991.2 GT3 T, F80 M3 C
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Dublin, OH

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by vladberca View Post
I think that Macan affected the sales of X3. I don't understand the sales of the 5er. They should add a 220i to the lineup. In Europe is available an 114i model!
That was my take also when the Macan S entry price is $50 K.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:11 PM.




f30post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST