4,1 kVIEWS
8REPLIES
4APPRECIATES
02/07/2020LAST POST

Bonjour à tous,
Je veux juste partager mon expérience en tant que client de seconde main avec ESS. J'ai acheté mon E92 M3 avec un kit ESS VT1-550 déjà installé.
J'ai rapidement décidé que je voulais aller avec un kit vt2.

J'ai contacté ESS au sujet de la mise à niveau (pour le kit 625 ou 650). Ils ont été très amicaux avec moi au début (bien sûr). J’ai commencé à discuter un peu avec eux, il me manquait du pouvoir sur mon VT1 à ce moment-là. J'avais un des anciens kits avec les injecteurs rouges, je n'étais pas sûr que la mélodie était d'eux aussi.
Après discussion, j'ai décidé de passer aux nouveaux injecteurs bleus et d'acheter un câble clignotant pour re-flasher une bonne mélodie avec les plus récents injecteurs comme solution temporaire avant de passer à mon kit vt2. Ils ont affirmé que cela faisait partie du kit de mise à niveau et que le prix serait déduit de ma mise à niveau (j'ai ceci par e-mail si quelqu'un en doute).

Maintenant, quelques mois passe, et je décide de commander mon vt2-625 mise à niveau. Et maintenant bien sûr, les injecteurs et le câble ne font pas partie de la mise à niveau et le prix ne sera pas déduit de ma commande.
J'ai commencé à en discuter un peu, je les ai même cités. Aucun moyen de les amener à s'excuser pour une mauvaise comunication, et encore moins donner un rabais pour honorer leur parole.
Je trouve toujours leur matériel génial et ce n'est pas comme si j'avais le choix de le trouver ailleurs, donc je vais l'acheter et commander ma mise à niveau.

Je reçois ma commande, il manque un tuyau et chaque pince. J’ai dû trouver un magasin local et acheter les pièces manquantes. J'espère qu'ils m'ont remboursé le prix payé à mon magasin local pour ces pièces.

Après avoir installé le kit, je me souviens de la charge de base et du retour des anciennes pièces. Nous n'avons pas discuté de cela, mais je me souviens de quelques messages (probablement ici quelque part ?) disant que le coût total de mise à niveau était d'environ 2600$ une fois la charge de base déduite. J'ai payé 3000 $ pour le mien, alors j'ai envoyé un e-mail à AJ à ce sujet et il m'a dit qu'ils ne me faisaient pas payer une charge de base.
Je réponds exactement ce que j'ai dit ci-dessus, que je me souviens des gens disant que la mise à niveau totalisait environ 400 $ de moins que ce que j'avais payé en retournant les vieilles pièces, et je lui dis que je ne veux pas pousser pour l'argent une fois de plus (après les injecteurs / câble chose) et que j'ai un projet pour E85. Je lui propose essentiellement de retourner mon ancien manifold + poulie + injecteurs rouges en échange d'une plus petite poulie et de mettre les tables de carburant de mes prochains gros injecteurs dans la mélodie qu'ils ont fournie pour mon kit 625 (Parce que j'aime leur mélodie, je ne voulais pas d'un autre fournisseur, exactement la même mélodie avec mes nouvelles tables de fule à l'intérieur). Je lui dis même explicitement que je sais qu'ils ne le soutiennent pas et que je ne demanderai pas de soutien et que je peux signer une renonciation ou quoi que ce soit pour ne pas les tenir responsables en cas de panne de moteur.

Apparemment, cela l'a vraiment offensé, je vais juste citer la réponse directement:

Il n'a jamais été $ 2600 + noyau.

Et je suis vraiment désolé, mais j'ai atteint la fin de la route en me disputant sur le prix avec vous. a m'ennuie énormément et heureusement nous avons la possibilité de choisir avec qui faire des affaires.

Si vous n'aimez pas votre kit de mise à niveau et le coût que vous avez accepté avec moi, alors renvoyez-le pour un remboursement. Nous avons terminé ici, et je ne vais pas aborder beaucoup de questions sur la construction personnalisée qui ne font que perdre complètement mon temps.

Notez que je n'ai même pas posé de question de construction personnalisée à aucun moment. Je suis un homme adulte, je pense que j'aurais pu prendre un "non" comme réponse, ou peut-être une option alternative ou même une citation appropriée si l'accord ne lui semblait pas juste. J'ai du mal à comprendre comment vous pouvez gérer une entreprise aussi prospère pendant si longtemps, mais soyez aussi puéril lorsque vous traitez avec des clients.

Quoi qu'il en soit, cela a été une diatribe assez longue, j'ajouterai que je ne critique pas leur produit, ce qui me semble toujours génial, mais si je devais tout refaire à partir d'aujourd'hui, j'aurais clairement acheté une voiture avec un SC d'une autre marque. C'est dommage de recevoir ce genre de réponses d'une entreprise à laquelle vous avez donné des milliers en quelques mois.

who was it from ess that you spoke to?
amrazM wrote
who was it from ess that you spoke to?
AJ
Sorry to hear, but understandably vendors are often operating on tight margins.

Something about the whole review feels skewed. That quoted response from AJ, would imply a lot of back and forth exhaustion... If you settled on a price, why sit on the decision for months before pulling the trigger? I don't think many businesses would honor a quote after 30 days. Lastly, I would suggest "support" and continued discounting are not one in the same. Especially considering you're not the original customer.

I can appreciate it's a huge bummer to drop $3k for an upgrade, but did you complete the install? Are you happy with the new performance?
Perhaps you should have done price research before buying? I wouldn't expect them to honor anything you "heard" someone say. Always get pricing direct from the source and do your research before buying and use what others say as just a guide, as things change, as do the prices.

Perhaps you handled it in the wrong way and the relationship broke down. If you were missing parts you should have brought that up as the first.
DRLane wrote
Sorry to hear, but understandably vendors are often operating on tight margins.

Something about the whole review feels skewed. That quoted response from AJ, would imply a lot of back and forth exhaustion... If you settled on a price, why sit on the decision for months before pulling the trigger? I don't think many businesses would honor a quote after 30 days. Lastly, I would suggest "support" and continued discounting are not one in the same. Especially considering you're not the original customer.

I can appreciate it's a huge bummer to drop $3k for an upgrade, but did you complete the install? Are you happy with the new performance?
Of course, I can understand they have tight margins and all (Although this is subject to debate, 400$ for a flashing cable, I doubt the margin is even close to tight on that for example), I'm not a choosing beggar I'm fine as long as everything is clear from the beginning.
I'm trying my best to not leave a skewed review and base my judgement on facts rather than emotions. I am trying to quote only relevant parts of the conversation as we had over 70 e-mails of exchange (mostly at the beginning when I was talking about my then-current kit and underwhelming performances based on a dyno result), but I'm not quoting them out of context to bend things in my favor. I very rarely had bad experiences with business as I usually try to check with them the most I can about a product before ordering to avoid disappointment later on.

I didn't pull the trigger earlier cause I contacted them as soon as I bought the car, but when starting the registration process in my country later on, I was told I had to go through a special testing process as the car was US spec (I'm in EU). Knowing it would take months and require me to put the car completely back to stock, I prefered waiting until that was done instead of going through the effort of upgrading right away and having to take everything back off then on again few months later to pass the tests.

Actually there wasn't much of back and forth concerning the price, they first told me the upgrade would be 3k and what was included in the upgrade (They mentionned injectors and flashing cable). I asked them if I could get the injectors and cable first and get that deduced from my future 625 upgrade order (Because they do not check for tune nor injectors upon registration test, so I could get the benefits from clean new injectors and tune right away, and it would be one less step to do later as it is part of the upgrade anyway). They answered me directly to that question by Yes.

Here are some quotes :
Upgrade to VT2-625 91aki fuel is $2995 plus shipping.

Upgrade to VT2-650 93aki fuel MINIMUM is $4495 plus shipping.

VT2 kits have a water to air intercooler built into the intake manifold, front mounted heat exhanger, with lines, reservoir, and Bosch electric pump.

Upgrade kits would be new manifold, intercooling system, belt, injectors, tuning cable with new tune, pulleys.

You would return your injectors, manifold, and pulley to us.
.. few mails talking about stuff

Me :
Also, if I end up ordering the cable and eventually injectors, will you deduce that from the price of the upgrade to the 625 kit when I sorted everything out on my 550 ?
Answer:
Yes, the new injectors are the same ones as used in the 625 kit.
Note I specifically asked if that would be deduced from my 625 kit upgrade.
Now fast forward to when I ordered the upgrade :

Them :
The upgrade cost is 2995 + shipping to VT2-625.
Me :
Wait i'm confused. When I first asked about upgrading, you told me the vt2-625 upgrade is 2995. The upgrade kit includes new injectors and cable. I already bought that separately, you told me it would be deduced from the price of the upgrade kit whenever i'm ready to do the full upgrade.
Them :
The upgrade cost I quoted you was from a VT1-550 to a VT2-625.

If you have a VT1-550 kit then you already have the cable and the correct injectors. IF you had an older kit with different injectors and you did not have an E-Flash cable for the car then obviously the upgrade kit would be more money since you did not have what was needed to perform the upgrade.

$2995 is for the chargecooler manifold with front cooler system/pump/lines and pulley/belt + manifold attachment brackets + matching software.
The thing is when I asked about the injectors and flashing cable deduced from my order they indeed knew that I had no cable and that I had older red injectors cause they asked me about it when we started talking about injectors. They even told me injectors and tuning cable was part of the upgrade on the first quote they gave me for the upgrade ...

After that there's been a back and forth of 3 more e-mails, essentially me quoting them like i did here before I gave up, they wouldn't even apologize for misleading me I mean how could I have figured this out by myself with the informations they gave me ... Even a little "sorry, that was a miscommunication, although we cannot honor these prices because of our tight margins, we can take off 50 bucks of your order or give you a discount on this or that if you want to make another order with us" would have been enough (And that is how any reputable business would act as well. We're not talking about a 5$ mistake, it's a freaking thousand). It's not even a money problem, hopefully I had the money, it's just about doing business properly and acknowledging your mistakes.

Anyway I went throught cause there's no one else I could buy the upgrade from. And then there was no back and forth about money before the answer I quoted on my first post.
Just me asking if I was supposed to send back old part to get a core charge refund, them telling me yes but there was no core charge applied to my order, and me telling them everywhere I saw people talking about upgrade had a core charge reimbursed and that it amounted to a total of roughly 2600$ for the upgrade after being reimbursed (And proposing an alternative deal as described in my first post).

I agree we did not settle on anything about it beforehand, and that's my bad for not asking this particular question earlier. It was just common sense for me, I don't see why they would not have charged me a core return, I live on the other side of the planet and they don't know me. There's no reason they would trust me to send them back the parts on good will, especially after what happened with the injectors and cable.

To answer your last question, I did complete the install and as I said in my original post, there's really nothing bad to say about the product. It's working fine, and they sure know how to make proper hardware.
tdott wrote
Perhaps you should have done price research before buying? I wouldn't expect them to honor anything you "heard" someone say. Always get pricing direct from the source and do your research before buying and use what others say as just a guide, as things change, as do the prices.

Perhaps you handled it in the wrong way and the relationship broke down. If you were missing parts you should have brought that up as the first.
Indeed, as far as the core charge goes that's my bad for not asking them prior. As I said in my previous answer, that was just common sense to me, even if we didn't specifically agree on a price. I didn't expect them to honor what other people say, but at least give me an offer. I don't really trust they didn't apply a core charge on my order, doesn't really makes sense that was the quote I got from my first ever exchange with them. Did they trust me right off with sending back old parts after I received the kit ? I don't know I may be wrong but from my research on that matter everyone I saw talking about it had core charges applied to their order. Anyway, it's just the way they answered to that, after all the quirks that happened with the injectors and cable beforehand that made it the cherry on the cake. Again, not really a money problem it's just the global feeling of carelessness.
Maybe I handled it the wrong way, I tried my best to be respectful and give them options, not imposing what I want (Essentially tried to not be a Karen). I never had problem with any business before, I usually have good exchanges with most business owner I buy from especially in the car business as we share the same passion so I was a bit surprised by how this conversation turned out.

I'm not sure what missing parts you're talking about though
gnjax wrote
I'm not sure what missing parts you're talking about though
gnjax wrote
I receive my order, it's missing a hose and every single clamp. I had to find a local shop and buy the missing parts. Hopefully they reimbursed me for the price paid at my local shop for those parts.
:sigh:

Your long rambling doesn't really make sense, best of luck, maybe there is a language barrier.
That's why I told you I did not understand what you were talking about, because I thought it was clear in my first post with the sentence you just quoted. I brought that up to them as soon as I noticed there were missing parts in the upgrade kit I received. They told me to just go and buy them from a local shop, and then refunded me for the price I payed at the local shop for all the missing parts I had to buy myself.

I was just trying to make a point about how careless they've been with handling my order. It's just simple "quality control", the kit doesn't have that many parts, forgeting 1 hose out of 5 + every single clamp for these hoses is really low effort. Even if this is not a huge inconvenience, it's still disappointing to receive a product with missing parts, having to find a shop that sells those parts, drive there etc ...

Sorry I try to explain the best I can, english is not my mother tongue, please point out any part that doesn't make sense and I will try rephrasing :)