DSilk wroteYou make it sound like bmw took a sawzall to all premanufactured v10s. Design drawings were probably changed and they probably started with a smaller block.Correct. The V10 in the M5 was initially developed for use in the Sauber-BMW team's F1 race car, and the V8 that powers our M3s had 2 cylinders lopped off for size and weight considerations. Was cost-effectiveness part of the equation? There is no doubt that is cost less to lop off 2 cylinders from a thoroughly developed race engine than to produce a clean sheet V8 meeting BMW M's requirements. The inline 6 in the e46 M3 was producing as much power as it could reliably produce without FI, and the M division was all about high revs and high specific output with power at the top end, which meant that more cylinders were needed.
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The V8 and V10 only share some some basic architecture, there is quite a bit that was changed for the V8. Some significant changes/improvements and simplifications to the oiling system, VANOS, Ignition/knock control, etc.
The S85's also suffer from rod bearing issues. There were fewer S85's produced so there aren't as many in number, but I suspect the failure ratios are probably about the same. Someone that specializes in them like Jim C. or Troy J. would have more insight on that.
The S85's also suffer from rod bearing issues. There were fewer S85's produced so there aren't as many in number, but I suspect the failure ratios are probably about the same. Someone that specializes in them like Jim C. or Troy J. would have more insight on that.
The s85 has quite a different torque curve than the s65. S85 makes peak torque @~5500 rpm and it is not broad and flat like that of the s65, which makes peak torque at 3900 rpm. That's a 1600 rpm difference but both engines have the same redline. This gives the s85 a different character than the s65, especially when downshifting for power. The power band is narrower in the s85. I think that's a huge difference, especially if the car is a 6mt. Just imagine if the s85 developed it's peak torque at 3900 rpm? Beast...
r0cketm0nkey wroteIndeed you'll sleep better only if you believe that. There is no way to fix it, if there were no blown engines that had their bearings replaced it would not be a false hope. But there are.I wouldn't say 100%...there are some whose bearings still look very good at six digit miles. But my opinion is, if you're going to keep the car for that long anyway, just do it and go to sleep better for it.
Rajmun340 wroteThread?Indeed you'll sleep better only if you believe that. There is no way to fix it, if there were no blown engines that had their bearings replaced it would not be false. But there are.
carenthuziast wroteIt's not that simple, but the V8 was derived from the V10 in much the same manner as GM's V6 was derived from its V8. The BMW V8 and V10 share bore and stroke measurements (which means they share pistons and connecting rods), cylinder bank angle, and construction material. They obviously cannot share crankshafts, since offset and firing sequence are different, but they share the same basic block design. Both engine blocks were built in the same engine facility (the one dedicated to BMW's Formula 1 engine production).You make it sound like bmw took a sawzall to all premanufactured v10s. Design drawings were probably changed and they probably started with a smaller block.
k3silk wroteThey're giving us run around (as expected)... idk what next option isKnown issue with our cars 2008-2013 get the red bearing fix costing anywhere from 2000-3000 and you are all set. Unfortunately for you it destroyed the engine before you got a chance to take care of this. Hopefully BMW NA can Goodwill or help out with some of the cost.
shimmy23 wroteCorrect^ 2008 with 100k+ miles. I don’t see bmw doing a damn thing about this
Isn't there a 30 day warranty from your dealership at least? They practically sold you a time bomb on wheels. You might want to defer to a lawyer to weigh your options.
r0cketm0nkey wroteWe have a 50-50 warranty (I cover half he covers half)... so yes if we put a used engine we pay half half .. but I wanna reverse the deal to be honestIsn't there a 30 day warranty from your dealership at least? They practically sold you a time bomb on wheels. You might want to defer to a lawyer to weigh your options.
yeah_knee wroteI'm no lawyer, but if the 50/50 warranty is in writing, it might be difficult on your side to argue for reversing the transaction. Usually that's reserved for cars returned within 3 days (yours was 4), or if it's a lemon. Again, I'd defer to a lawyer for your best course of action.We have a 50-50 warranty (I cover half he covers half)... so yes if we put a used engine we pay half half .. but I wanna reverse the deal to be honest
You could alternatively drop in a used engine, but by then you might as well replace the rod bearings before you drop it in, and enjoy it for a while...or just sell it for what you paid for it. I imagine you would lose out some cash on the latter. Good luck either way.
r0cketm0nkey wroteHad another meeting with the dealership. Looks like we're going to do an engine rebuild. Replace the engine block and put new engine components that need to be replaced. They're being cooperative and told me I'm only responsible for 1/3 and they will cover the 2/3 of the job. That's my best bet right now.yeah_knee wroteI'm no lawyer, but if the 50/50 warranty is in writing, it might be difficult on your side to argue for reversing the transaction. Usually that's reserved for cars returned within 3 days (yours was 4), or if it's a lemon. Again, I'd defer to a lawyer for your best course of action.We have a 50-50 warranty (I cover half he covers half)... so yes if we put a used engine we pay half half .. but I wanna reverse the deal to be honest
You could alternatively drop in a used engine, but by then you might as well replace the rod bearings before you drop it in, and enjoy it for a while...or just sell it for what you paid for it. I imagine you would lose out some cash on the latter. Good luck either way.
Would you care to tell us how they came up with the % of responsibility?
BOOF-M3 wroteInitially I signed a warranty for 50-50 for the first month... but due to this situation they're giving me a 33-66 deal for the job that needs to be done.Would you care to tell us how they came up with the % of responsibility?
yeah_knee wroteThat seems fair.Initially I signed a warranty for 50-50 for the first month... but due to this situation they're giving me a 33-66 deal for the job that needs to be done.
Isn't a new short block from BMW around $20K (if you can find one) + labor to swap all components and install?
decimation1 wroteI priced out a short block last week and they said 8300, long block was 20ish I recall. I'm going to have to cross a similar bridge soon. Main bearing totally destroyed with worn rod bearings...Isn't a new short block from BMW around $20K (if you can find one) + labor to swap all components and install?
They=bmw
Duk996 wroteShort block is including just the block, crank, pistons, oil pan and pump? Or does that come with the heads and timed too?I priced out a short block last week and they said 8300, long block was 20ish I recall. I'm going to have to cross a similar bridge soon. Main bearing totally destroyed with worn rod bearings...
They=bmw
decimation1 wroteDef. no heads, not sure about pump and whatnot. Def block, crank, and pistons. I'm learning about this all too FYI.Duk996 wroteShort block is including just the block, crank, pistons, oil pan and pump? Or does that come with the heads and timed too?I priced out a short block last week and they said 8300, long block was 20ish I recall. I'm going to have to cross a similar bridge soon. Main bearing totally destroyed with worn rod bearings...
They=bmw
DSilk wroteYa he found an engine block for 3k... and then they're going to start replacing broken componentsyeah_knee wroteThat seems fair.Initially I signed a warranty for 50-50 for the first month... but due to this situation they're giving me a 33-66 deal for the job that needs to be done.
An engine rebuild can only be beneficial in the end right? I've been advised to sell it after I fix it but I want to enjoy it a little bit hahah everyone is worried I will still have issues down the line
