Track Day Insurance

redpriest wrote

I used to use Lockton but they started putting lots of additional exclusions (HPDE-4 NASA not covered, certain tracks not covered).

Switched to RLI. They offer coverage for time trials, which is great. Also, you don't have to find the specific track day organizer - you can specify meaning you can use this policy for private track days.

I cover my e92 for 35,000 and that costs about $200 for non time trial, $240 for. My M4 costs about $600 for non time trial, 1-3 days for $88,000.

Interesting, thanks for sharing the info on RLI.

You're saying that $35,000 of coverage with RLI sets you back about $200 per track day, and $88,000 is around $600? Do they offer any sort of multi-day or season discounts?

dparm wrote

redpriest wrote

I used to use Lockton but they started putting lots of additional exclusions (HPDE-4 NASA not covered, certain tracks not covered).

Switched to RLI. They offer coverage for time trials, which is great. Also, you don't have to find the specific track day organizer - you can specify meaning you can use this policy for private track days.

I cover my e92 for 35,000 and that costs about $200 for non time trial, $240 for. My M4 costs about $600 for non time trial, 1-3 days for $88,000.

Interesting, thanks for sharing the info on RLI.

You're saying that $35,000 of coverage with RLI sets you back about $200 per track day, and $88,000 is around $600? Do they offer any sort of multi-day or season discounts?

200 covers 1,2,3 days. If you're doing 3 consecutive days at the same track it covers the whole thing

redpriest wrote

200 covers 1,2,3 days. If you're doing 3 consecutive days at the same track it covers the whole thing

Great, but for one-day events, you lose that value proposition.

what is RLI website?

RLI Corp. I just google it every time and it comes up.

I'm actually looking at The Open Track now. They are a bit more focused on high-value policies, but offer full-season pricing which is nice since I get the flexibility to go as often as I want (which also amortizes the premium across more events). Also a slightly lower deductible than the others.

https://www.theopentrack.com/

dparm wrote

I'm actually looking at The Open Track now. They are a bit more focused on high-value policies, but offer full-season pricing which is nice since I get the flexibility to go as often as I want (which also amortizes the premium across more events). Also a slightly lower deductible than the others.

https://www.theopentrack.com/

Open Track is great if you don't plan on running any timing devices. I am going through the process of a claim with RLI atm with regards to my E46. $6300 in damages.

redpriest wrote

Open Track is great if you don't plan on running any timing devices.

Can you explain? Do their policies have something explicit that says any sort of "timing" disqualifies the event from coverage? Would that mean that activating my car's built-in data recorder negates my coverage?

dparm wrote

Can you explain? Do their policies have something explicit that says any sort of "timing" disqualifies the event from coverage? Would that mean that activating my car's built-in data recorder negates my coverage?

It depends on how your track insurance policy is worded. The ones I have dealt with specifically define what an HPDE is, what a non-competitive time trial is, and what a competitive time trial is. With RLI, who I deal with, there are multiple degrees of coverage, with each one getting progressively more expensive.

In the track policy I have, they have very specific definitions:

"“Driver Education Event” means a safe driving program that includes classroom education, technical inspection, and
on-track exercises. The event’s primary purpose is to improve the “covered driver’s” driving skills in a safe learning
environment and under controlled conditions. A “driver education event” does not include “non-competitive time trials”
or “competitive time trials” unless endorsed.

10. “Non-Competitive Time Trial” means an on track exercise during which the lap times of “scheduled automobile” are
recorded for the personal use of the “covered driver”, but not for any competitive purposes.

11. “Competitive Time Trial” means an on track exercise during which the “covered driver” is competing against other
participants, either on the track simultaneously or via timed runs, where placement or time is used to determine prizes
of any sort or value, or where placement or time is used to accumulate points, standings, or rankings of any sort at the
event or in an ongoing competition or series."

Fortunately, in my case, I had competitive time trial coverage.

I would assume that the insurance companies would go to rigorous lengths to determine that you weren't cheating them, including checking your social media to see if you've posted videos with timing data, talking with the event organizer.

For me, I had to get a track incident report from the event organizer so they could determine coverage.

Many of the track organizers in California will post your timing data if you rent a transponder - that could be used to disqualify you, for example.

redpriest wrote

It depends on how your track insurance policy is worded. The ones I have dealt with specifically define what an HPDE is, what a non-competitive time trial is, and what a competitive time trial is. With RLI, who I deal with, there are multiple degrees of coverage, with each one getting progressively more expensive.

In the track policy I have, they have very specific definitions:

"“Driver Education Event” means a safe driving program that includes classroom education, technical inspection, and
on-track exercises. The event’s primary purpose is to improve the “covered driver’s” driving skills in a safe learning
environment and under controlled conditions. A “driver education event” does not include “non-competitive time trials”
or “competitive time trials” unless endorsed.

10. “Non-Competitive Time Trial” means an on track exercise during which the lap times of “scheduled automobile” are
recorded for the personal use of the “covered driver”, but not for any competitive purposes.

11. “Competitive Time Trial” means an on track exercise during which the “covered driver” is competing against other
participants, either on the track simultaneously or via timed runs, where placement or time is used to determine prizes
of any sort or value, or where placement or time is used to accumulate points, standings, or rankings of any sort at the
event or in an ongoing competition or series."

Fortunately, in my case, I had competitive time trial coverage.

I would assume that the insurance companies would go to rigorous lengths to determine that you weren't cheating them, including checking your social media to see if you've posted videos with timing data, talking with the event organizer.

For me, I had to get a track incident report from the event organizer so they could determine coverage.

Many of the track organizers in California will post your timing data if you rent a transponder - that could be used to disqualify you, for example.

Wow, there is so much good info in here. I get track insurance through Lockton Motorsports for every track event. I have never considered that there would be different types of coverage, or that certain activities (like timing one's laps) could possibly impact the insurance company's decision if I ever needed to file a claim. This hasn't really mattered that much for me, until now - starting with my next track weekend in a few weeks I am going to start actively timing myself and tracking my progress. I guess I should really do some homework about the different companies out there that offer this type of insurance, and also read up on what exactly is covered or not covered. Thanks for explaining all of this!

DreamTime wrote

Wow, there is so much good info in here. I get track insurance through Lockton Motorsports for every track event. I have never considered that there would be different types of coverage, or that certain activities (like timing one's laps) could possibly impact the insurance company's decision if I ever needed to file a claim. This hasn't really mattered that much for me, until now - starting with my next track weekend in a few weeks I am going to start actively timing myself and tracking my progress. I guess I should really do some homework about the different companies out there that offer this type of insurance, and also read up on what exactly is covered or not covered. Thanks for explaining all of this!

This is Ryan Staub from Lockton Motorsports - just thought I'd chime in and save you the hassle of having to do homework on this. I've been instructing for ~15 years (Chief Instructor for KC Chapter of BMW CCA) and I'm a big believer in data acquisition. While I don't feel HPDE students/track day guys should be chasing lap times, data and lap times are often the best indicator of improvements you're making as a driver.

From the beginning, we've pushed our insurers to not have restrictive or exclusionary language related to timing. If you use Harry's Lap Timer, an AiM system, etc, that will not trigger any limitations or exclusions in coverage on our policy. We do offer Time Trial coverage as an option to your HPDE/Time Trial policy, but that option only needs to be selected when it is a true Time Trial event. If the event organizer administers timing and the event is competitive, you need to add the "time trial" option to your policy to ensure coverage with us.

I hope that helps. Have a great season and keep the shiny side up!

Ryan

gottagofast13 wrote

This is Ryan Staub from Lockton Motorsports - just thought I'd chime in and save you the hassle of having to do homework on this. I've been instructing for ~15 years (Chief Instructor for KC Chapter of BMW CCA) and I'm a big believer in data acquisition. While I don't feel HPDE students/track day guys should be chasing lap times, data and lap times are often the best indicator of improvements you're making as a driver.

From the beginning, we've pushed our insurers to not have restrictive or exclusionary language related to timing. If you use Harry's Lap Timer, an AiM system, etc, that will not trigger any limitations or exclusions in coverage on our policy. We do offer Time Trial coverage as an option to your HPDE/Time Trial policy, but that option only needs to be selected when it is a true Time Trial event. If the event organizer administers timing and the event is competitive, you need to add the "time trial" option to your policy to ensure coverage with us.

I hope that helps. Have a great season and keep the shiny side up!

Ryan

Cool! I super appreciate all the info, Ryan! Hope you have a great season as well

Good news - OpenTrack does not considering self-timing to be competition! If you're doing lots of events per year, their flat full year coverage and multiple car policy is a no brainer to me IMO. They are also the only ones that I can see carry liability insurance along with their policy too.

Just finishing up my RLI track insurance claim and the process has been completely painless. Would recommend them for time-trial coverage all day.

about to sign up for 1-day track insurance with RLI
glad to see some positive feedback about the company in here

Yes RLi is good. Friend did a claim on his car that was totaled. They took care of him

RLI is also the cheapest for me, even when adding club discounts. Luckily, I've had no claims.

Hoping to resurrect this topic, as I’m now looking at track day insurance. I’ve done around 10 days with no close calls, but with some experience now, I’m wanting to push the car a little harder.

I’ve done some research on the following (E92 M3 30k car value + 5k mod value):

Hagerty/RLI $231- 15% deductible

Open track $320- 10% (annual 260.97 5% deductible)

Lockton Motorsports-BMWCCA 10% discount- $227 (15% deductible

Has anyone had to file a recent claim? How did it go?

-Steve

sperkins wrote

Hoping to resurrect this topic, as I’m now looking at track day insurance. I’ve done around 10 days with no close calls, but with some experience now, I’m wanting to push the car a little harder.

I’ve done some research on the following (E92 M3 30k car value + 5k mod value):

Hagerty/RLI $231- 15% deductible

Open track $320- 10% (annual 260.97 5% deductible)

Lockton Motorsports-BMWCCA 10% discount- $227 (15% deductible

Has anyone had to file a recent claim? How did it go?

-Steve

I know of few folks who have submitted claims to RLI and Lockton with no major setbacks. My wife used OnTrack and we ran through hurdles with Great American Insurance (the underwriter) in regards to getting paid out. Took months of pinging the agent as they were taking their sweet ass time. I heard from my bodyshop guy that worked with RLI, they were paid out in less than 2 weeks meanwhile my wife's setup took over 3 months.

Track insurance makes sense if you can't walk away from a crash + misc fees (towing, damages to the track).

derbo wrote

I know of few folks who have submitted claims to RLI and Lockton with no major setbacks. My wife used OnTrack and we ran through hurdles with Great American Insurance (the underwriter) in regards to getting paid out. Took months of pinging the agent as they were taking their sweet ass time. I heard from my bodyshop guy that worked with RLI, they were paid out in less than 2 weeks meanwhile my wife's setup took over 3 months.

Track insurance makes sense if you can't walk away from a crash + misc fees (towing, damages to the track).

Thanks Derbo, this is exactly what I was looking for.

I hope your claim gets resolved soon!

sperkins wrote

Thanks Derbo, this is exactly what I was looking for.

I hope your claim gets resolved soon!

It was resolved. It took 3 months to get a check out of them when the car was clearly totaled. That left a sour taste for Ontrack's underwriter. Ontrack has been solid to work with but I can't say the same for Great America Insurance.

I would have no hesitation with Opentrack/RLI/Hagerty/Lockton. Do look at their fine print, some do not support open groups. I know OpenTrack does not support Sonoma unless you go with their annual policy which sucks for me since I don't go that often.

Opentrack has been great to work with. While I’ve never filed a claim, they’ve been great about responding to questions and helping understand when you’re in a competitive time trial situation that is not covered.

Thanks everyone for this information. Very helpful!

Just purchased an RLI 1-day policy for this weekend based on the input given here. $290 for the day with $40k coverage feels worth it.