Track forum general chit chat.

roastbeef wrote

i found the pics and i recalled incorrectly;
headliner with nothing else on it; 6 lbs
a/b/c pillars; 2.11 lbs
front and rear light consoles; 1.12 lbs
insulation stuck to roof; 1.4 lbs

only thing i don't have a weight for is the sun visors and grab handles... so about 12-13 lbs in full trim.

My headliner is also aftermarket alcantara along with the a/b/c pillars. So it probably weighs slightly more. I'll be sure to weigh it when removing. Cage is going in this winter.

Rubin

kolosy wrote

Are vp racing jugs safe for standard fuel? I see people use them on track all the time, but then when I go to read the specs on Amazon it says “not for highway fuel” but also “for racing fuel”

Would love to stop paying th 100% markup at the track if I can.

I have 4 VP jugs that I use to fill up at Sam's Club and then haul fuel to the track. Be sure to get an extra top with a filler neck just in case.

On top of that, get one of these. Makes life far better and less messy.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CKMVHS9V?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title&th=1

turbo_joe wrote

Totally fine, they have to put that since they dont use the safety flow spout. I carry 5 of them to the track any time I race filled with 93oct

ahhh the safety spout...a great american invention:lol:

This is incredible

2009 BMW M3 GT4 - $170,000

Very cool. But no way in hell that's worth $170k... You could recreate a GT4 build nowadays, with the same or better parts, for less. Even if you had a shop do everything.

Maybe I just need more money...

tsk94 wrote

Very cool. But no way in hell that's worth $170k... You could recreate a GT4 build nowadays, with the same or better parts, for less. Even if you had a shop do everything.

Maybe I just need more money...

90% of the cost of this car is due to the NIB OEM Ignition Coils.

The car just comes at a discount.

omgzirra_exe wrote

90% of the cost of this car is due to the NIB OEM Ignition Coils.

The car just comes at a discount.

LOL. Valid point.

What manual fire extinguisher are people running? I need something 2.5 lbs with an amerex bolt pattern because I don’t want to pay brey Krause another $300 for their quick release bracket.

kolosy wrote

What manual fire extinguisher are people running? I need something 2.5 lbs with an amerex bolt pattern because I don’t want to pay brey Krause another $300 for their quick release bracket.

I run the Amerex 1.4lb Halotron I Fire Extinguisher - Model A384T. They make a 2.5lb version too (Model B385TS). It's mounted in a generic front of the seat quick release bracket. Comforting to know this will do the job and not make a mess of the car.

If anyone is looking for Ferodo DS1.11 for AP Racing Calipers !

https://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2182591

Ok so how do I dial out understeer? Was reading this suspension secrets article, and messing around with rebound settings seems like an easy first step (I’ve got ohlins dt one ways), but after that I’m at a loss. Shift brake bias rearward? Sway bar changes?

kolosy wrote

Ok so how do I dial out understeer? Was reading this suspension secrets article, and messing around with rebound settings seems like an easy first step (I’ve got ohlins dt one ways), but after that I’m at a loss. Shift brake bias rearward? Sway bar changes?

Are you staggered or square? Going square is a great way to dial out understeer. The front end is just sharper and the rear just wants to rotate more willingly (but not snap into oversteer).

If you don't want to invest then you can play with more front toe out, thicker sways at the rear or more damping rear/less damping front. But the effects won't be as noticeable as going square.

What is the max SAFE coolant temp to be running at track? Want to know what temp to set my HUD warning at.

Redd wrote

Are you staggered or square? Going square is a great way to dial out understeer. The front end is just sharper and the rear just wants to rotate more willingly (but not snap into oversteer).

If you don't want to invest then you can play with more front toe out, thicker sways at the rear or more damping rear/less damping front. But the effects won't be as noticeable as going square.

Already square :/

Running 275 on 18x10s, and am getting ready to throw on 295s on 18x11s

kolosy wrote

Already square :/

Running 275 on 18x10s, and am getting ready to throw on 295s on 18x11s

If you're already square trying reducing rear toe as close to zero as possible (but not zero). I run 7-5 minutes of rear toe-in per side and rear likes to rotate nicely.

Redd wrote

Are you staggered or square? Going square is a great way to dial out understeer. The front end is just sharper and the rear just wants to rotate more willingly (but not snap into oversteer).

If you don't want to invest then you can play with more front toe out, thicker sways at the rear or more damping rear/less damping front. But the effects won't be as noticeable as going square.

When you say 'less', are you saying stiffer or softer? The article quoted earlier mentioned reducing understeer by 'increasing front damper rebound stiffness'. I (perhaps mistakenly) always thought that to decrease understeer I should reduce the stiffness of the shock (to align with my understanding of using less rollbar stiffness in these situations).

Perhaps I have that backwards which would be good because I have been fighting mid-corner and corner exit understeer and this would give me something to consider besides (or in addition to) driver error.

kolosy wrote

Ok so how do I dial out understeer? Was reading this suspension secrets article, and messing around with rebound settings seems like an easy first step (I’ve got ohlins dt one ways), but after that I’m at a loss. Shift brake bias rearward? Sway bar changes?

Before adjusting dampers or alignment I would start with your sway bars. If you have an adjustable rear sway bar you can tighten it. A very good friend and my driver coach always has me start any adjustments with sway bars, then we move onto other pieces.

The other thing to consider is steering input. If your hands aren't opening fast enough at apex you could be causing understeer by getting on throttle too early before the car is already completely turned.

Hopefully this is some good nuggets to digest.

Rubin

former 240 s14 wrote

Before adjusting dampers or alignment I would start with your sway bars. If you have an adjustable rear sway bar you can tighten it. A very good friend and my driver coach always has me start any adjustments with sway bars, then we move onto other pieces.

The other thing to consider is steering input. If your hands aren't opening fast enough at apex you could be causing understeer by getting on throttle too early before the car is already completely turned.

Hopefully this is some good nuggets to digest.

Rubin

Thanks! For me the understeer is most prevalent on corner entry (though I'm going to go back to the Solo data and try to verify that). Sway bar isn't adjustable, but definitely an upgraded unit (PO did it). Given the fixed sway bar, I think I'm better off trying the rebound settings first since that's free.

One thing -- could ride height impact understeer? I had the car corner balanced after all the weight loss and I think he f'd it up, car definitely sits a lot higher than it did before (though it *is* corner balanced)

kolosy wrote

Thanks! For me the understeer is most prevalent on corner entry (though I'm going to go back to the Solo data and try to verify that). Sway bar isn't adjustable, but definitely an upgraded unit (PO did it). Given the fixed sway bar, I think I'm better off trying the rebound settings first since that's free.

One thing -- could ride height impact understeer? I had the car corner balanced after all the weight loss and I think he f'd it up, car definitely sits a lot higher than it did before (though it *is* corner balanced)

Ahh, my bad, I thought I read corner exit.....

Ride height absolutely affects dynamics. If you look at stock BMW's from our generation of car the front is higher than the rear, which helps produce understeer (which is the safer of the two options for most novice drivers.)

Look for a post about ride height I made a few months ago here, there were some great conversations about it which should help!

Rubin

kolosy wrote

Thanks! For me the understeer is most prevalent on corner entry (though I'm going to go back to the Solo data and try to verify that). Sway bar isn't adjustable, but definitely an upgraded unit (PO did it). Given the fixed sway bar, I think I'm better off trying the rebound settings first since that's free.

One thing -- could ride height impact understeer? I had the car corner balanced after all the weight loss and I think he f'd it up, car definitely sits a lot higher than it did before (though it *is* corner balanced)

Corner-balance may have lifted the nose too much.

An E9x likes only a small factory rake (form what I understand, I could be wrong): front wheel center to fender roughly 5 mm higher than the rear, 7 mm tops imo. If the front sits higher than that, lower the front or raise the rear to get back in range. Too much front rake shifts weight rearward and makes the car push.

for your damper settings:

It's been a while but iirc, my Ohlin's settings was 7F and 6R from which is close to the "max" recommended track settings via Ohlin's 0-7 settings.

This lets weight transfer to the nose as you trail off the brakes while keeping the tail from squatting, so the car rotates instead of plowing.

Alignment:

These are settings I used over the years.

Front: start with about 1/16″ total toe-out. You can creep toward 1/4″ if you need more initial bite, but that gets twitchy fast.

Rear: 1/8″ toe-in to keep exit stability.

Front toe-out pre-loads slip angle and sharpens turn-in.

Usually my rear toe never changes once I set it, my front Toe in usually goes from 0 to 1/16" Toe In before a track day, street driving I keep it at 0

If you have a sway bar, maybe do the next softest setting as the last adjustment. but don't most people with sway bars just have the front and rear set to default middle settings?

included Pic for reference on the front rake, when I had Ohlin's and 19s lol.

Alignment specs attached too to make sure rear toe isn't out of whack. This setup along with proper corner balancing makes it very neutral with a touch of oversteer.

Rubin

former 240 s14 wrote

Alignment specs attached too to make sure rear toe isn't out of whack. This setup along with proper corner balancing makes it very neutral with a touch of oversteer.

Rubin

Awesome. Negative toe is toe out, right? Also, any chance you know your ride heights? Arch to wheel center ideally. I confirmed that I have forward rake (about 4” clearance at the front jack pad, 5.5 at the rear)

kolosy wrote

Awesome. Negative toe is toe out, right? Also, any chance you know your ride heights? Arch to wheel center ideally. I confirmed that I have forward rake (about 4” clearance at the front jack pad, 5.5 at the rear)

I don't off the top of my head and your height will change once you corner balance by a slight margin.

Look in this forum for a thread I made on the subject (I'll look for it later.) There were great conversations about ride height reco's in the thread.

Rubin