Official S65 Injector Failure Thread

Assimilator1 wrote

Wow!

Btw, what's the year and mileage of your friend's car? And which injector failed? (would be handy to know so I can add his case to the blown engines list).

I don't think this would be a fair assessment to add to the list because I was the one that cleaned the injector and used the sonic clean on it.


At any rate, it was #1 injector, and when I pulled the oil cap, it smelled completely like gas. That's why I then pulled the injector rail to see what injector it was. And in doing so, you can see a drop of fuel dripping from it.


I feel responsible, so I'm rebuilding a new block for my buddy.

Ok, although if you used an automated cleaning system, I can't see how it can be your fault.
Btw, do you know what the spray patterns were like before you cleaned them?

RocketyMan wrote

Darn. Well I still have it. I can literally blow air straight thru it.

I'll chip in to have it shipped to Assimilator. Let's do this, let's try and figure it out.

Assimilator1 wrote

Ok, although if you used an automated cleaning system, I can't see how it can be your fault.
Btw, do you know what the spray patterns were like before you cleaned them?

Maybe the cleaning system wasn't appropriate for this type of injector? Spitballing here.


Or the injector had some kind of weakness that the cleaning exposed.


(Or it was a coincidence)

Assimilator1 wrote

Ok, although if you used an automated cleaning system, I can't see how it can be your fault.
Btw, do you know what the spray patterns were like before you cleaned them?

There are I think 3 holes on each side of the injector, with being 6 total. 3 pointed at left intake valve and other 3 at the other.
My thinking is either the sonic cleaner and/or the cleaning solution used caused this underlying issue. I don't know. It's just that it happened right after I cleaned these injectors. So I was the last to modify/change something when it didn't necessarily need it.

I have a hard time thinking it's pure coincidence.

HairTooLongToo wrote

I'll chip in to have it shipped to Assimilator. Let's do this, let's try and figure it out.

I'd probably want to ship all 8 of them. Even tho the other 7 didn't exhibit leaking at the time...it could be telling to compare the one that was stuck open vs the other 7 potentially leading up to it.

Well 2 would cover that base then, 8 might substantially increase the shipping cost.
But if you want to see what the shipping cost of either option is, my work postcode is GU12 6LR, I think that'll be enough to experiment with.

Btw, is it me?, or are none of the 6 injector spray patterns you show spraying properly? Looks like they're all jetting to me rather than spraying.

Assimilator1 wrote

Well 2 would cover that base then, 8 might substantially increase the shipping cost.
But if you want to see what the shipping cost of either option is, my work postcode is GU12 6LR, I think that'll be enough to experiment with.

Btw, is it me?, or are none of the 6 injector spray patterns you show spraying properly? Looks like they're all jetting to me rather than spraying.

This is most likely a consequence of the "cleaning" solution that is in the injector cleaner. It's non-volatile....so it probably doesn't atomize like what you would expect with benzine...aka hydrogen bonding vs solvent-based.

Shipping is coming out for me from $100 to $200. Looks like USPS is the most affordable for flat rate, but it's wanting a tariff code. I might have to put this as a refurbishment part with no value. I'll have to figure this out.

Geebus that sounds outrageous, but I'm committed, we can exchange details via PM when you're ready

Okay. Let me get these together. I'm thinking I can expertly pack them and ship them in some sort of flat rate box.

You could have done a perfect job cleaning the injectors. I don't think this is your fault. I am convinced the problem is not the injectors.

How many miles are on the car? My hypothesis is old fuel filters can get clogged, creating increased pressure required to flow, and the pressure forces slightly larger particles through. These would eventually make their way to an injector and clog it to the point it is stuck open.

Interesting that this is injector #1, as my hypothesis above sees mostly injector 6 or 7 (plz don't say it) stuck open since they are most directly from the fuel line. Did you put all injectors back into the same cylinders? Or switch them around. It could also simply be the act of removing and reinstalling the injector stirred up/knocked loose some buildup that then got stuck in the injector.

RocketyMan wrote

Shipping is coming out for me from $100 to $200. Looks like USPS is the most affordable for flat rate, but it's wanting a tariff code. I might have to put this as a refurbishment part with no value. I'll have to figure this out.

It used to be some years ago that anything gifted from the USA didn't incur extra charges/taxes, and seeing as you are literally are gifting it to me you should treat it as such. Hopefully gifts are still exempt?

That's very expensive shipping!

The one in the orange tape is the one that leaks. I'm going to see if I can get a better quote.

RocketyMan wrote

The one in the orange tape is the one that leaks. I'm going to see if I can get a better quote.

Cool, don't post anything yet, I haven't spoken to any injection specialists yet (I've messaged one, haven't heard back yet, just tried again with an email this time) [edit]......... not that you have my full address yet anyway!

Assimilator1 wrote

Cool, don't post anything yet, I haven't spoken to any injection specialists yet (I've messaged one, haven't heard back yet, just tried again with an email this time) [edit]......... not that you have my full address yet anyway!

Alright cool. Keep me updated.

Had mine fail a month or so ago.

Year: 2011

Miles: 116,000

Injector Failure symptoms: not much, a very very slight rough idle on cold start until it started to misfire which is when I took it in but was too late

Duration driven with symptoms: a week or so

Secondary failure: scored cylinder 1

Injector failure cause or theory: the shop wasn’t sure. At first they thought the DME had gone bad, replaced that but still had misfire codes. Checked the injectors and cylinder one was stuck wide open. The odd thing is it was misfiring on all cylinders not just the cylinder with a bad injector.

IamFODI wrote

Question to those of us here who have experienced this failure:

Anyone been doing regular used oil analysis prior to the failure? Might be interesting to see if it showed any warning signs (e.g. fuel dilution going up, viscosity going down, inexplicable increases in wear metals).

I had done an oil analysis not long before my car started misfiring and it came back totally clean. Very frustrating.

Feezed wrote

Had mine fail a month or so ago.

Year: 2011

Miles: 116,000

Injector Failure symptoms: not much, a very very slight rough idle on cold start until it started to misfire which is when I took it in but was too late

Duration driven with symptoms: a week or so

Secondary failure: scored cylinder 1

Injector failure cause or theory: the shop wasn’t sure. At first they thought the DME had gone bad, replaced that but still had misfire codes. Checked the injectors and cylinder one was stuck wide open. The odd thing is it was misfiring on all cylinders not just the cylinder with a bad injector.

Sorry for that, mate. I've been there.

Do you a have a planned route now?

Feezed wrote

I had done an oil analysis not long before my car started misfiring and it came back totally clean. Very frustrating.

Frustrating for sure – but, to be clear, when I said "regular" oil analysis, I meant a series of samples, e.g. at every oil change. A report can look good in isolation but raise some eyebrows when compared to other reports from the same engine.

Feezed wrote

Had mine fail a month or so ago.

Year: 2011

Miles: 116,000

Injector Failure symptoms: not much, a very very slight rough idle on cold start until it started to misfire which is when I took it in but was too late

Duration driven with symptoms: a week or so

Secondary failure: scored cylinder 1

Injector failure cause or theory: the shop wasn’t sure. At first they thought the DME had gone bad, replaced that but still had misfire codes. Checked the injectors and cylinder one was stuck wide open. The odd thing is it was misfiring on all cylinders not just the cylinder with a bad injector.

Did you have fuel smell in the cabin during that week at all?

IamFODI wrote

Frustrating for sure – but, to be clear, when I said "regular" oil analysis, I meant a series of samples, e.g. at every oil change. A report can look good in isolation but raise some eyebrows when compared to other reports from the same engine.

It probably wouldn't show anything IMO. Once the injector sticks open, things happen pretty fast.